On another thread here, we started talking about if the police and courts should ever step in when something terrible happens on the ice. What's the standard. I have always had trouble understanding why something that happens in the stands gets someone arrested, while 15 feet away on the ice it's just part of the game. Isn't breaking the law, breaking the law?
I'm not suggesting that everything that happens on the ice should be subject to arrest and prosecution, but there will be and have been incidents that should be considered for this. Remember this play a few years ago? That was atrocious and in my mind should have been prosecuted.
What do you guys think? Is there anything that happens on the ice you think could be subject to the laws of society, or is it anything goes? What if someone deliberately attacks someone and they die from it? That will happen someday because no matter how much players get suspended, the incidents keep getting worse. Would it make any difference to you if it happ
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I except your challenge, I think if it is malicious and with forthought and the sole purpose it the intent to injure. Prosecute them. That's why fights in the stands get people hauled away in handcuffs. That and disorderly conduct. I have know problem if in the course of the game two guys square away. Completely different story. It's the seriousness of the intent to injure that is the defining act. Using sticks would be one of those kinds of acts. Blakes is correct in that the game is played on the ice and should stay on the ice. Criminal acts should not be part of the game. Any game or sport! The risk for injury is there every game and the players know it and except it. Your absolutely right Blake someone is going to go to far and kill someone. It will than fall on 12 men & women to decide if it was criminal or not. We will not be able to decide that here. Each incident will be decide on it's own merits. If you took a pole I am sure if would come out 50% agree with me and 50% would not. I have seen a lot of hockey games can only remember one incident I thoughty went to far. Bob Bailey swinging a stick with the intent to injure someone on his mind. You could see it in his eyes. That was one very ugly situation. OK, folks it's your turn have at it.
I think you could raise a tremendous amout of reasonable doubt and not get 12 people to agree.
It would be tough, fighting in itself is malicious. There have always been paybacks or forthought in hockey.
Also this is entertainment that includes hitting and fighting.
Now if you were to change the rules and say no more fighting or hitting or slashing etc.... Then I think you could prosecute someone.
i agree with dschiebig, if the action was harsh enough, i mean double handed baseball swing to the head or kicking a downed opponent, that would be harsh enough. but i think it should be left up to the person on the receiving end to press charges, not the court system. but if your face gets blown up in a fight and you get a concussion, learn to protect your face better. i have been watching hockey for 17 years and i don't recall ever seeing anything that warrants prosecution.
I think Icy should get arrested for beating up Tony Tomatoe.
I think a fights a fight and thats fine. If someone drops to the ice it should be done then. If sticks or any other materials are used against the other player then that should be done as well. If the players still go forwards and keep fighting that person then they should receive charges.
i think tony tomato should get arrested for wearing those tights
from the perspective of one who played, there are lots of unwritten rules in the game, a somewhat gentlemans agreement, thats why you see some brusiers pat one another on the butt when the fisticuffs are finished. retaliation is a part of the game, but you cross the line when your intent to hurt someone goes past makin them sore or submiting to submission. a slash to the ankle or back of the knee, a crosscheck to the shoulder or chest, they are all intended to hurt and send a message not injure, so the line is crossed when the slash becomes two handed or the crosscheck is to the head or the spear is to the faceis made. these go past trying to "hurt" someone and now fall into the trying to injure category. maybe these are thethings that need to be prosecuted to clean the game up. guys hardly get injured in a fight but get hurt which is diferent but when you two hand someone or get a crosscheck tothe head is injures you and that needs policed instead of banning fighting.
soory my spelling is like a school teachers!!
There is no place in this game for goons. A normal hockey fight is part of the game, leave it alone. If a stick is used as a weapon it should be prosecuted. When Todd Bertuzzi attacked Steve Moore (?), we all had a prime example of someone who jumped WAY over the line. Prosecution should always follow that.
Hockey is a great game. Play it with honor and respect.
I hear what everyone is saying, but there is no way to distinguish it. Attorneys would have a hey day with it
Attorneys have a hey day with everything. That doesn't change the fact someone who breaks the law should be prosecuted.
Like I said before, I can imagine incidents that would warrant criminal prosecution, but they would have to be pretty extreme. Even the incident in the clip above didn't strike me as being that bad -- at least not based on what I saw in the video. That's why we have "intent to injure" penalties. Is the guy a repeat offender? Did he cross-check someone in an especially heinous way? Fine. Ban him from the sport. Simple as that. But hockey is a game where tempers are supposed to flair, and players are permitted to act on their emotions. Not to mention that with a game as fast paced as hockey, accidents will happen. Someone moves a few inches to the right at the last second, and a relatively benign hit turns into something much more serious. It's a danger, and those who play the game accept that danger. So what would it take for me to think the courts should become involved. Maybe if someone deliberately went after someone with a skate blade between plays. That sort of thing. Like I said, it would have to be really ridiculous to the point that it had NOTHING to do with the game itself.
Finally, would it change my mind if it were one of my favorite players who was seriously hurt or killed? I worry about that all the time, but like I said, it is their choice to face that danger. They know what could happen. It's a risk, but then nothing in life is risk-free. Just getting out of bed in the morning could do you in, so you might as well get out there. God forbid if something should happen, at least you die doing what you love.
Did Captain Hook or Ogie Oglethorpe get thrown in jail?
I thought about this a lot today and I think it will take someone getting killed in a malicious attack to change the rules of the game(forced by the insurance companies/economics) which in turn will change hockey forever
I posted this at the end of a previous thread before reading this one but I'll repeat it anyway.
Over the years there have been several cases of hockey players being prosecuted for their actions on the ice. There was even a manslaughter case in the early 1900s (I think) when a player was clubbed to death on the ice. So Blake, it has already happened.
The case I'm most familiar with was when Dave Forbes hit Henry Bousha in the eye with his stick during a confrontation, 1975 I believe. Henry lost sight in the eye and his career in hockey. Forbes was charged with aggravated assault by the State of Minnesota and was acquitted when the jury couldn't reach a verdict. Henry's younger brother Eddie was a friend of mine at the time and skated with the Milwaukee Admirals.
I'm in Dschebig's court on this one. Intent should be the deciding factor. Carelessness could also enter into it but I think that would be better handled by the league and not the courts
I think Moore should of fought & it would not of happened= he cheaped shot Nasland and had to pay his .
i agree with mightbite on that one