Some in the Occupy Space movement seem to be turning on each other:
It's a den of thieves!
Occupy Wall Street protesters said yesterday that packs of brazen crooks within their ranks have been robbing their fellow demonstrators blind, making off with pricey cameras, phones and laptops -- and even a hefty bundle of donated cash and food.
“Stealing is our biggest problem at the moment,” said Nan Terrie, 18, a kitchen and legal-team volunteer from Fort Lauderdale.
Comments
Leo:
..."It's called redistribution of wealth"...BRILLIANT!
(how "true")
Wonder if ONE of those models includes a LEGALLY ARMED POPULACE, willing to PROTECT their assets by FORCE (because the police have become inadequate in such an aftermath)?
Now that would be fun to see.
;)
Talk about ironic:
"
I now hear they are upset with their college debt they owe. Some say they were snookered into going to college and now face $15K, $30K and $100K or more in student loan debt and believe this should be forgiven.
I wonder what will happen when this group realizes that the current SS-OASI program has a present value unfunded liability of over $23 Trillion! That student debt will look really tiny compared to Social Security. Now add in Medicare and The National Debt.
They do not yet the true definition of Government Redistribution.
Well, I suppose if you're the sort of mouth-breathing idiot that actually thinks OWS is about actually stealing from the 1%, and that actually taxing corporations is somehow theft, I could see how you'd make that connection.
"that actually taxing corporations is somehow theft"
Corporations are taxed at 35% on profits. Individuals are taxed based on adjusted gross income at levels of 105, 25%, 28%, 33% and 35%. Corporations then have tax credits just as individuals have tax credits. Corporations are allowed to deduct the cost of creating the service or product from income.
I do not consider myself in the 1%, but I do own stocks in corporations. I believe the corporations I own pay their fare share. In fact many pay dividends which are taxed as corporate taxes and I pay a tax based on qualified dividend rates.
Corporations are not owned by a single entity, but millions of entities, some very large, and most small lots. When a group talks about taxing the 1% by taxing corporations, I have never seen how at the same time will not tax the small investor who has a pension, 401K, IRA, Roth IRA or non qualified account. Can you clarify the taxing of the 1% from taxing the corporation or are they one in the same?
Since I am the only responder that used the word "owe" will assume that Christopher is responding to my position "I now hear they are upset with their college debt they owe. Some say they were snookered into going to college and now face $15K, $30K and $100K or more in student loan debt and believe this should be forgiven." But then I did not use the term "theft." I must be having one of those bad days where things are not making sense. Hey, but I am in good company with the 99% who I think are not making much sense right now either.
Speaking of "not making much sense right now", I see that Mary Bender told Occupants that Fort Wayne will be shutting off water to the restrooms at Headwaters West very soon, perhaps as soon as Monday.
Drinking water isn't a problem for Occupants, since spring water costs less than 25c in those 35-pack cases, but how many people are going to want to pay $3 for 4 jugs of water to flush? And 4 jugs is about 35 pounds. How many people are going to want to tote the jugs in?
It's going to be expensive to clean up. Not a brilliant move on the part of the city.
William, it's already been documented that most major corporations aren't paying anything close to that 35%, we've been over that.
Swing, you might wanna back that up with some proof. Show us the documentation you reference above.
Harl, what's worse, having a feces ridden mess to cleanup or replacing all the piping from a freeze? Those pipes get turned off every year so they don't freeze...
Larsen & Zank: You didn't have any problem with the evidence presented the last time that was brought up. Larsen may have forgotten about and that's why he repeated the 3x% assertion, but I'm certainly not wasting time on Zank when I know he's simply being aggressively stupid, as usual.
Can't prove it can ya Swing? What brings ya back, did they run ya out of the park?
That's funny, Tim, I wondered where you went after your public display of ignorance on journalism. Family isn't there to pull you away from the computer and stop you from embarrassing then and yourself this afternoon?
Well, if nothing else, you're good for another installment of Tim Zank, Useful Idiot.
Probably more evidence than needed, but at least now you'll be able to find it again easily by searching for your own tag now.
I wondered where Michaelk42 had toddled on off to.
I just had a word with him! He misses calling you out, but hasn't had time lately.
Sorry Tim, but other people around her have friends, and there's more than one person in this town willing to point out you're an idiot. XD
@Zank
I know this must come as a shock, Timmy, but other people have friends.
Are you some sort of internet detective now? I'm too busy to do more than watch you make a fool of yourself lately.
Then again, maybe I'm littlejohn and all the other people who disagree with you, too! XD
"William, it
"Those under age 46 and eligible to vote outnumber all other voters combined."
Yet the corporations, with monetary donations and lobbyists, have the greater influence over the code than any of the people. You're essentially saying that the system is supposed to and should work a certain way on paper, while ignoring what's actually going on.
It would be nice if the system worked as you've described it, but it doesn't, and that's part of what's being protested about.
>> what
Christopher Swing wrote "It would be nice if the system worked as you
"Because the vast majority of those under 46 do not vote, they should not be protesting what they could easily fix with voting one of their own in."
Where is this mythical, unicorn-like "one of their own?"
The big two parties do everything they can to keep it a two-party system. Two parties where one is only slightly less obvious about serving the needs of their corporate donors.
It doesn't matter if more people vote for the same two rigged choices.
Swinger, you posit:
"Where is this mythical, unicorn-like
Ah, Zank, childishly insulting as always.
I think what you're really afraid of is that not only are we irritating the right people now, we're not paying attention to your childish smears and we're not going away.
Because if we weren't already getting changes made, why would you be so upset in the first place?
We're not playing the rigged game anymore. People like you are right to be afraid.
Christopher, I have nothing agaist what you are doing. In fact, I think your group and the Tea Partiers will get to share the credit a few years from now after Obama or whoever might succed him decides not to do another wasteful 'stimulus' plan. But if you want to change things you have to be involved in the political system, not just complain about it. Instead of just complaining about the same two stale choices each fall, why not do one of the following:
1) Vote in the primary. The more normal, down-to-earth types always get eliminated there because most of the people voting are the hard-core partisans. Want a better candidate in the fall? Then support a better candidate in the spring.
2) Work with a candidate during his/her campaign and find out what it's all about. Find out how, after working your ass off to promote your message, only a handful of people show up at your campaign rally to hear what you have to say. Find out how many of those people that are always complaining about how bad things are clam up and won't say a word when a candidate asks them directly what needs to be done. Find out how many of the same people who complain about the money will say that a candidate who is not well financed is not a serious contender.
3) Support a third party/independent candidate.
4) Run for office yourself instead of always expecting someone else to fix YOUR problem. Notes from #2 above apply here with the general summary of find out for yourself that the average citizen is just as dishonest, conniving and cowardly as the average politician.
The magical unicorn is in the mirror, if you'd just look at it!
1) Hey, guess what, you're going to be seeing a lot more of that. I suspect the partisans aren't going to like it.
2) So pointing out that politicians are too influenced by money from a specific source means someone can't recognize that money is too much of a requirement to run? And are we not counting those instances where elected officials or candidates have people thrown out/arrested when they ask questions they don't want to answer, or even for simply recording those meetings/fundraisers/etc.?
3) Let's change election laws so that a third party is actually viable. Of course the people in charge of changing those laws belong almost entirely to those two parties.
4) Now you're just being pessimistic.
So can we just sum up your points as "why aren't you participating in a system specifically engineered over time to prevent you from making changes to that system to make changes to that system?"
Christopher,
Here is a toll free number to call your senator (800) 928-8084. It will give you garbage about saving/preserving the status, but just press 1. It will then ask for your five digit phone number to connect you to your senator (two selections here).
I called both mine today and spoke to their staff for a couple of minutes. I told them how I supported repealing the Social Security Act as well as Medicare and gave the reasons why.
"When a person says
"I think what you
"You are not getting the attention of congress."
Demonstrably false, via a 0.29 second Google search - an example - http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/index.cfm?sectionid=61&itemid=429
"You are a divided group with no unified defined issues."
We're a group of many different people with a number of issues we want addressed. Sorry you want them to be neatly packaged so you don't have to think very hard, but there's a lot of problems to be addressed. We're not letting you dictate the rules anymore.
"You are protesting Wallstreet greed, but Wallstreet does not make the laws."
We're protesting Wall Street greed and government enabling. Just because you want to ignore that second part doesn't make it go away.
"Wallstreet supports both parties with donations, wine and dine, etc."
Which is why OWS is fed up with both parties. See also the previous point.
"If you want to make it work, do what I did in 2002, run for congress; create a list of issues."
Which accomplished what? And why do you think there aren't any occupiers who are going to be running for office? What kind of dumb advice is this, anyway? Do we ALL have to run for office? Why do you get to give up?
William, if you really want occupiers to get behind your personal plan to fix everything, why aren't you there at the general assemblies, or posting at http://occupyfortwayne.org/forums/ ?
[Ah. I put more than one link in or something so the automoderate must have kicked in.]
"why aren
All set to reply until:
"As for Wallstreet Greed, since I am an investor, I guess you consider me greedy as well."
WTF William, again? How many times in this thread alone have you been corrected on this false assumption?
You keep repeating the same false assumptions and incorrect information over and over, and don't even acknowledge being questioned on it, much less being corrected. And then you proceed to demand that the people you don't even understand participate in a broken system that they're protesting because it is broken.
William, the problem with your defense of the rich is that when the corporations failed at their own game, they asked for and received a major change in the rules to their benefit and to the detriment of most Americans. The social contract was totally shedded under the bailouts.
We have $15 trillion in national debt now. That's about $45,000 per individual in this country. Approximately 40% of that debt was incurred just in the past 4 years. Most of this money was given to people who didn't need or deserve it. The public was told they weren't allowed to know where all of this money was going. We have also been told that much of it was loans that have since been repaid with interest. So why didn't the debt drop if it was repaid? They screwed us and they are still lying to us about what they did.
In the past four years, the government has placed a nearly $20,000 bill around my neck, and they didn't give me a damn thing for it. I support the Occupiers because the more people of any group that are protesting about our out of touch and out of control government means it is less likely the government will steel more from us in the near future.