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News-Sentinel.com Your Town. Your Voice.
Opening Arguments

A stunner

Wow. An illegal immigrant actually gets punished for breaking the law:

A Mexican national living in Indiana who has repeatedly returned to the United States after being deported will serve 62 months in prison for illegally re-entering the United States.

That prison time will come on top of time Juan Mata-Talavera, 37, is serving for a felony battery conviction, Justice Department officials said Monday.

Now we know. If you come here illegally four times and commit felony battery, you'll finally be in trouble.


Bob G.
Wed, 08/01/2007 - 9:06am

OK...lemme do the math on that:
3 strikes, and you're OUT.
4 "balls", and you DON'T walk, but get busted.

Who's reinventing America's favorite pasttime?


Andrew Kaduk
Wed, 08/01/2007 - 4:56pm

Great, now [the taxpayers] get to pay to keep him in jail (in the U.S.) and we don't so much as get our vegetables picked or our restaurant tables bussed by him in return.

I guess I really don't mind him doing time for the felony battery...that's kind of a no-brainer... but paying to jail our serf-class immigrants for walking across an imaginary line in the dirt seems self defeating.

Barry Wiggins
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 8:03am

"...paying to jail our serf-class immigrants for walking across an imaginary line in the dirt seems self defeating."

You're right, Andrew, how ridiculous for the USA to, like, enforce our laws.

What's really ridiculous is that we have people like you who support the importation and preservation of a serf-class in modern America. No, we can't have American farmers paying people living wages or devising smarter ways to harvest crops. Living wages and technological innovations? That's just crazy talk!

tim zank
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 10:47am

Not to trivialize Mr. Kaduk's analysis in r/e the "imaginary line" but good fences make good neighbors. Just because I have a huge yard with no fence does not mean I want anyone and everyone in my neighborhood setting up a pup tent and a campfire in my yard. The whole concept of property ownership is a very dear one in this country, and though we may not personally own the land in and around that "imaginary line" as a society we do.

If you remove all the rhetoric, political posturing, emotional blackmail, and finger pointing and just look at it from a common sense standpoint, you can't remain a sovereign nation without borders and without rules.

I don't advocate lining them all up and shooting them, or raiding every factory, or snitching on your neighbors. All you have to do is build a wall (spare me the taller ladder argument), then let cops do their jobs, force (and I mean force) employers to verify immigration status (no exceptions), and force federal & state agencies to verify immigration status BEFORE handing out benefits. By simply following the law the "illegal" population would shrink pretty rapidly.

Bob G.
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 12:24pm

Thank you, Tim.


(who needs a fence to keep HIS neighbors the hell OUT)

Andrew Kaduk
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 4:50pm

Chief Wiggins,

Last I checked, the serfs were importing themselves. Far be it from me to argue with their desire to leave one substandard lifestyle (Mexico) in favor of another (East LA). If it is farm reform you want, go bitch to your reps in Washington about the ludicrous agriculture subsidies that [the taxpayers] dish out to artificially fix crop prices and quash competitive ag markets. Don't blame the Mexicans, they didn't do anything that you wouldn't do, were you walking in their shoes.


I have a fence. It's white, and 4' tall, just enough to keep a drunk from falling in my pool. I have to have one by local ordinance. It's illegal for my neighbors to walk across my yard, fence or not. However, I will not be calling on my congressman to pass federal legislation to build me a wall/fence/outpost/gun turret. I am not at all threatened by Mexican immigrants, legal or not, so I just don't care how many of them are here. If they come here and break actual criminal laws...you know, where other people are actually victimized beyond some "They're takin' our jobs" dogma, then throw them in jail for that.

No, Chief Wiggins, it's not a ridiculous concept for us to enforce our laws, but when the laws themselves are ridiculous, everything thereafter will by default be ridiculous, including the enforcement thereof.

tim zank
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 7:57pm

Andrew, why is the law to deport illegal immigrants ridiculous?

Andrew Kaduk
Thu, 08/02/2007 - 9:05pm

Because the laws that make them "illegal" are ridiculous. If they want to be Americans, for god's sake, let them be.

Alcohol prohibition laws were ridiculous, they were repealed after the Gov failed to find an efficient way to enforce them. Immigration laws are equally restrictive and ludicrous. Repeal them.

Barry Wiggins
Fri, 08/03/2007 - 9:16am

Andrew "Mongomery Burns":

"Last I checked, the serfs were importing themselves." Read much? I didn't accuse you of *importing* serfs. I accused you of *advocating* the importation and preservation of the serf class. Which you did. (Advocate, that is.) Andrew said:

Andrew Kaduk
Fri, 08/03/2007 - 8:51pm

I honestly don't think I've ever been accused of being "politically correct" before. Quite to the contrary, many find me to be quite the opposite, whatever that is. To answer your points in order:

1. If the serfs wish to be serfs, OK, I won't argue. If they wish to be more than that, swell. I'm down with that too. I'm not looking for servants at my house.

2. A Mexican and a purse thief are hardly synonymous...the US, after all...is supposed to be a refuge for all types and colors of refugees...regardless their origin.

3. Go ahead, piss in my pool. See how far that gets you...and no, I'm not on Gump Road. That's my uncle and his wife.

4. You wanna hang out for a BBQ? Ok, go for it. I'm a hospitable host.

5. Nobody is suggesting that we build a wall along the Canadian border, are they? Yes, I'm suggesting Mexican friendly laws.

Barry Wiggins
Fri, 08/03/2007 - 9:59pm

Andrew: "A Mexican and a purse thief are hardly synonymous." I didn't say that they were. The *illegal* Mexican (or *illegal* Irish, etc.) are *analogous* to--not synonymous with--the purse-thief.

Andrew: "the US, after all